Is there truth too this ?

[Newbie@work]

Hey all, I got an e-mail from my cousin. Here's what he's saying

"Just letting you guys know that the technology already exists to survey
pirated Satellite TV signals by triangulation, so its a matter of time
before someone knocks at your door with a search warrant!"

Is this possible ?

Thanks.

[lefty]

Hey all, I got an e-mail from my cousin. Here's what he's saying

"Just letting you guys know that the technology already exists to survey
pirated Satellite TV signals by triangulation, so its a matter of time
before someone knocks at your door with a search warrant!"

Is this possible ?

Triangulation...... :rolleyes:

Now, there other ways to check what's being displayed onscreen, but triangulation is usually used for pinpointing broadcasted signals.

The image displayed onscreen is also sent further thru the ether and can be picked up with the right equipment. That technology has been in existance for years.

:cool:

[smilingjack]

You are right.
In England they (the Government) charges people to watch TV, like a TAX.
The drive down the street looking for untaxed TV sets in vans trying to pick up the faint signal a TV set produces. but they do not have the great mass of electronics in their houses that we do.


I doubt it is possible to tell what you are watching just that you have a TV set (CRT)working inside from the lost radiation in the RF frequency range.

Hell I have 7 CRT's going right now, just in my office.

[interboot]

it all boils down to the stupid scare tactics dave & charlie use. they can't think of any better way to scare people. their ecm department came up with this? boy, they are really dumber than i thought.

[geechrammstein]

I have heard that for years also, folks telling me that they have a truck with a dish on top the drives down the street and picks up what you are watching. Then supposedly they bust you if you are watching something you don't pay for.

[PT2]

The only way a signal can be triangulated, is if your transmitting the signal, not receiving it....

[smilingjack]

I have heard that for years also, folks telling me that they have a truck with a dish on top the drives down the street and picks up what you are watching. Then supposedly they bust you if you are watching something you don't pay for.


They only do that in England.

The only way a signal can be triangulated, is if your transmitting the signal, not receiving it.... .


Every reciever transmits a certain amount whenever it is receiving.

They do not triangulate just locate on a directional (a certain house address)

They can not tell what channel you are watching, just that a tv is turned on. That's all the English needs to TAX you for having a TV.

[HITEKREDNK]

Any reciever unless shielded can have some discernable emmissions that can be detected. However, the amount that typical dish/dss recievers emit, it would take an expensive detector equipment and very close proximity . These emissions are generallt called tempest hazards .Don't worry, be happy. it's kind of like looking for stars with a microscope, You don't see anything untill your on top of it. Any one coming on to my property uninvited gets the blunt end of my 12 ga. pointed generally in their direction to halt them. I'm not worried. It's just propaganda bro.
HITEKREDNK

[RADIOMAN_NYC]

Hey guy's,

Calm the FU<k down !!!!!!!!!! Trust me, I'm in the business (you might have gotten a small clue by checking my nick) there is no way anyone on this planet is "triangulating" signals being received by sat viewers. Triangulation works well if you have a good solid transmit signal to trace by using a method known as Doppler tracking, but it just wont work with sat receivers so rest easy. Yes, sure, every receiver, TV, radio, microwave oven, hair dryer, toaster oven, can opener, dust buster, or just about anything else that runs on batteries or plugs into the wall will give off some kind of signal that can be picked up with the right kind of equipment if your close enough and you have the proper filtering and preamplification, but it just plain old wont work on sat receivers. The kind of signals that they emit fall into the same catagory as about 10,000 other devices sold on the comon market today, and are currently in your home and mine and there is no way in hell to determine them apart PERIOD.

So rest easy, crack open a cold one, and go watch some T.V.

[geechrammstein]

Really I found it quite amusing too. Simply because of the fact that it first happened to me back in the '80's when I was using a simple descrammbler to pick up all the cable channels, which I think was like 35 back then. One HBO one Showtime, One Cinemax, One PPV and one porn channel, which back then was Playboy channel. That shit was lame but back then I was like 16 and Playboy was like the best thing to happen to a 16 year old.

[JT]

The international emergency frequency for airlines is 121.5Mhz. As long as your not emitting a bunch of that frequency you'll be fine. Search and rescue teams and airports monitor this frequency and can triangulate right to the source even if it’s weak. Oddly enough, a lot of AVR's and external emu boards emit a 9Mhz signal, which through the magic of radio interference can be picked up with one of those devices to look for a planes 'black box'. Here are a couple links to a more in depth discussion of this phenomenon. It’s very real and if you run an AVR or external emu board you should very definitely read at least the first thread linked to.

http://www.dssftp.com/forum/showthread.php?p=224716#post224716

http://www.dssftp.com/forum/t6663-crazy-.html

[smilingjack]

Actually airports have a device that does not have to triangulate it is a directional antenna with DME (distance measuring equipment)

I am not sure exactly what frequencies it can be tuned to other than aircraft frequecies but they can give an exact direction and the exact distance to the antenna/transmitter.

It is used to find lost pilots and give them directions them to the airport.

[gwabitz]

I can't believe how Hollywood inaccuracies have affected people, and their common sense.
How can someone triangulate you, if you're not broadcasting(sending out a signal)?
They can't.
If you were sending out your own TV channel, then someone could. Other wise no way!
It's just as ridiculous as when Hollywood action movies show the hero with a handgun, shooting at 50 bad guys, who of course have fully automatic assault rifles, and he never gets hit once, but manages to pick off every bad guy.
Pure physics would dictate that if you had over 100lbs of lead in the air coming straight towards you, chances are you will get hit, and not just stand there casually shooting back.
The same applies to this triangulation crap.
A radio receiver is exactly the same thing(or close to) as an AVR, and I would guarantee you that if that technology existed, every radio station out there would be knocking on your door asking you to buy every product out there that they were advertising!
You're just receiving a signal, not broadcasting one, think about it.
Leave the James Bond movie inaccuracies, for the ones who believe everything they see in the movies!
Yes they can triangulate you, and come knocking at your door. Honestly, I'm telling the truth. I saw it in a movie.

[JT]

I can't believe how Hollywood inaccuracies have affected people, and their common sense.
How can someone triangulate you, if you're not broadcasting(sending out a signal)?
They can't.
If you were sending out your own TV channel, then someone could. Other wise no way!
It's just as ridiculous as when Hollywood action movies show the hero with a handgun, shooting at 50 bad guys, who of course have fully automatic assault rifles, and he never gets hit once, but manages to pick off every bad guy.
Pure physics would dictate that if you had over 100lbs of lead in the air coming straight towards you, chances are you will get hit, and not just stand there casually shooting back.
The same applies to this triangulation crap.
A radio receiver is exactly the same thing(or close to) as an AVR, and I would guarantee you that if that technology existed, every radio station out there would be knocking on your door asking you to buy every product out there that they were advertising!
You're just receiving a signal, not broadcasting one, think about it.
Leave the James Bond movie inaccuracies, for the ones who believe everything they see in the movies!
Yes they can triangulate you, and come knocking at your door. Honestly, I'm telling the truth. I saw it in a movie.


Read the first link I posted. There is even a copy of the notice Industry Canada hand delivers to folks who are emitting frequencies of 121.5. This is very real and people have been busted this way. Not very often, but it has happened.

[smilingjack]

LOOK AT THE BACK OF YOUR IRD.

IT SAYS TESTED TO COMPLY WITH F.C.C. STANDARDS.

SO DOES YOUR COMPUTER.

THIS NOTICE IS ONLY PUT ON ITEMS THAT CREATE RADIO FREQUENCY TRANSMISSIONS

[gwabitz]

I rest my case, truly these people were emitting a frequency(sending out a broadcast) by altering their AVR's. EMU boards etc....
If a person is using a normal AVR unadultered,(no external transmitter or alterations to TRANSMIT a signal) there is no way someone is going to come to your door, because 50 million other people are using the exact same product the same way.
My AVR is not going to transmit because I'm using an atmega card!
My card is DECODING a signal not transmitting one!
You're paranoid!
You are wanting to believe something that is not true, because it MAY be possible!

[smilingjack]

No your AVR is not generating RF waves.

But YOUR IRD IS
And YOUR TV IS

I sincerely doubt they are going to come and get you though, since they don't know what you are watching.

[gwabitz]

Exactly, ALL consumer electronics emit frequency waves, providing they comply with FCC standards, so they don't drive coast guards etc... crazy with unwanted signals interfering with their 121.5 emergency frequency tracking equipment.
So, don't be paraniod that the SS is going to get you, because as long as you are watching and not transmitting, you'll be fine!
Over and out. Copy?

[JT]

I rest my case, truly these people were emitting a frequency(sending out a broadcast) by altering their AVR's. EMU boards etc....
If a person is using a normal AVR unadultered,(no external transmitter or alterations to TRANSMIT a signal) there is no way someone is going to come to your door, because 50 million other people are using the exact same product the same way.
My AVR is not going to transmit because I'm using an atmega card!
My card is DECODING a signal not transmitting one!
You're paranoid!
You are wanting to believe something that is not true, because it MAY be possible!

Dude, all electronic devices emit EMI. This is a known fact. Your atmega does not emit a frequency they look for, but it does emit EMI. This is not paranoia. This is a very real phenomonon you need to be aware of. Obviously you did not take the time to read that letter Industry Canada posts on residences emitting RFI (radio frequency interference) These guys can quite literally follow the signal right to your house if it's a frequency they're looking for. The standard AVR has a 9Mhz processor. Atmega's are 18 and 21 aren't they? Therefore, if not properly shielded, these devices emit RFI at that Mhz. It is not wise to overlook the realities were discussing here. It's not just paranoia. Read that letter and the posts from folks that have had experience with these guys coming to their door and telling them what's in their house without ever stepping inside. This procedure has been used to track down testers and charge them with crimes. Read that letter that Cancom posted in the first post in the top link I posted. If you are running a device that either directly produces 121.5Mhz RFI or produces that frequency via wave amplification, you are at risk. The solution is to shield your device. For example, an internal emu board is much safer than an external because it's mounted inside the receivers metal case. Use ferrite beads on your cables so that they aren't inadvertantly turned into antennas etc.

[bobbypooh]

Does anyone know what the June card swap will do to our blue cards or magic cards? I keep getting pop up notices that I will not be able to view after June 22. I called Dish and they said the yellow cards I pay for will not be switched, but the blue cards will. I wonder if we will go blank on June 22

[tbelisle]

Hell... I remember a couple of years ago, my dad had a automobile radiator on the roof of the cottage hooked to the tv set. Fucking great antenna, but the cops showed up and made us take it down as they said it interfered with the local airport transmition towers.

We had to take it down at that moment!

[RADIOMAN_NYC]

In response to "geechrammstein" who posted

You guys are good...
Really I found it quite amusing too. Simply because of the fact that it first happened to me back in the '80's when I was using a simple descrammbler to pick up all the cable channels, which I think was like 35 back then. One HBO one Showtime, One Cinemax, One PPV and one porn channel, which back then was Playboy channel. That shit was lame but back then I was like 16 and Playboy was like the best thing to happen to a 16 year old.
Reply With Quote

If you were tampering with "cable" signals your dealing with a "direct connection" which is absolutely traceable. It can easily be read from the pole tap outside your house, and with the right equipment, they can even tell what channel your watching, so let's say you only pay for "basic" and they see your currently watching a PPV event that you did'nt order, guess what ???? You're busted, but the same does not apply to sat. And for those people that think that just because a device is radiating a signal, which as I previously explained, it does, don't worry, it's so small of a signal, that it's extreemely difficult to pick up, even at close range with the best of equipment. Beleive me, my shop is filled with radio receiver test equipment, tracking equipment (specificly Doppler 6000) and the likes and I'm telling you, you have nothing to worry about in that department. It would be easier for them to travel around looking for dishes mounted to houses and going door to door to ask if they are being used because their database does'nt show the address as a paying customer, which by the way does not get them past the front door anyway !!!!

[smilingjack]

Don't forget to wear your tin foil hat when you go out because the aliens are transmitting messages to your brain.

And wear your sunglasses when you watch TV to avoid the subliminal messages in the programs.

And always put a blanket over the TV sets when not in use because they don't really turn off and the little cameras in them keep working and big brother is watching you through them.
They have been since 1984


This is getting really funny
but has nothing to do with Dish, Bev, testing or reality
so I think it should be relocated
to the funny farm

hehehe

[JT]

What I posted is real SJ. I moved the thread to beleive it or not, where it belongs. You guys can even ask Mili about this phenomonon. Read the fucking form letter you stubborn bastards. :rolleyes: The following letter appears on official Industry Canada stationary:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Sir/Madam:

On_________2005 it was determined that a radio signal capable of causing harmful interference to a safety-related radiocommunication system was emanating from, or in close proximity to, your home.

Recent investigations by the Department have determined that similar sources of undesired radio emissions have been traced to Bell ExpressVu Direct-to-home satellite receivers whose operation has been modified through the installation of an emulator card, commonly referred to as an “AVR card” or “pirate card:. This hardware is an after-market product designed to defeat the conditional access system of Direct-to-home satellite receivers and bypass the normal subscription requirements.

Our primary interest in this matter is to eliminate and prevent further occurrences of harmful interference. Therefore, if you have such and emulator card it must be disposed of in such a manner that it can not be installed in a satellite receiver again. Should you no longer with to retain possession of such a card, you may with to consider voluntarily surrendering the card to Industry Canada. Our office can be contacted to arrange for a voluntary declaration.

If you are not operating any such emulator card, please contact the undersigned Spectrum Management Officer (an “Inspector” pursuant to the provisions of the Radiocommunication Act) immediately at the number shown below. Arrangements will then be made to conduct an inspection of your premises in order that the precise source of the interfering radio signal can be determined and eliminated. In some cases, undesired radio emissions can originate from other (non-satellite receiver) electronic equipment.

It is extremely important that you do not ignore this letter. Your assistance and co-operation is required in resolving this matter and eliminating the source of radio interference. We also with to take this opportunity to point out that Section 8 of the Radiocommunication Act requires that the owner or person in charge of place where radio apparatus or interference causing equipment is present, provide the inspector with all reasonable assistance and provide and information the inspector reasonably requests in order to enable the inspector to carry out his duties under this Act. Failure to comply with these provisions could constitute and offense under the Act, resulting in prosecution.

If you have any questions concerning this matter, please contact myself at 250-470-5043. Thank you for your co-operation.

Yours sincerely,

Michael Amyotte
Spectrum Management Officer
Okanagan Kootenay Office

Canada
------------------------------------------------------------------------

I strongly urge you folks that don't beleive this is true and can happen to call Mr. Amyotte and have a conversation with him about this.

[tbelisle]

Looks like Mr. Amyotte can barely tell the difference between "wish" and "with"

I doubt he has the mental capacity to spectrum analyse a cellular tower let alone a metal box inside my living room that operates at a relatively close frequency as my damn microwave or cell phone.

Quick quick... wrap your house in foil, (Faraday cage) there comming for y'a!

[tbelisle]

For the paranoid....

http://www.lbagroup.com/technology/FaraCage.php


JT...would'nt that look good on top of the television?

No I do not own shares in this! Just fuckin with y'all

[JT]

Looks like Mr. Amyotte can barely tell the difference between "wish" and "with"

I doubt he has the mental capacity to spectrum analyse a cellular tower let alone a metal box inside my living room that operates at a relatively close frequency as my damn microwave or cell phone.

Quick quick... wrap your house in foil, (Faraday cage) there comming for y'a!

I typed that letter because the resolution on the original is poor. Guess that made it past my spell checker. The original is posted in the first link of post #11 in this thread.

[tbelisle]

the link takes me to the store.

Sorry JT... I'm just bored and being a dick as usual.

[geechrammstein]

Dude you're close but as far as aliens trying to read our minds you have that all wrong. It's the government reading our minds. They put a chip in your brain when you have an operation and then they use recievers in the street lights to pick up the signals that your brain is emitting.
As far as the tin foil hats that is totally wrong. Tin foil is a conductor so that would actually create the equivalent of an antenae on your head and make it easier for them to read your mind. It would be better to use a rubber hat. Depending on the type of rubber and the thickness that would very possibly block the signal. Also there is a substance in your fingernails that will mess up the signal also, so if you know where the chip is located in your brain you can put your fingernail up to your head and it messes up the signal, so when you are thinking something bad or illegal put your index finger up to your head while you think it and they can't read your mind, they just get white noise. White noise is dead people trying to make contact to the living world, which in most cases would not be useful information to the government.....hahahahahah.

[tbelisle]

I see dead people!.... wearing rubber hats!

[10ON.EXE]

You are right.

The drive down the street looking for untaxed TV sets in vans trying to pick up the faint signal a TV set produces. but they do not have the great mass of electronics in their houses that we do.


I doubt it is possible to tell what you are watching just that you have a TV set (CRT)working inside from the lost radiation in the RF frequency range.

Hell I have 7 CRT's going right now, just in my office.



In England they (the Government) charges people to watch TV, like a TAX.

It's not a tax as such. It's called a licence. Back in the old days,we had 4 channels to watch BBC1-3 and ITV. We never paid for these channels, so a licence had to be purchased every year. Except for Match of the Day and the odd fight usually involving a English boxer( Marvin Hagler v Alan Minter and Don Curry's title fights) it was not worth the fee.

We eventualy got an extra channel ( Channel 4) It was a little riskier, more alternative and had some great comedy. A lot of the best British comedians, Rowan Atkinson, Lenny Henry, Ben Elton, Griff & Jones, Rick Mayal / Adrian Edmonson ( The Young Ones) got their start on this channel. They also got the rights to Monty Pythons flying Circus after a few years, and the Secret Policeman's Balls. Actually looking back Channel 4 was worth the money for the licence alone.

[smilingjack]

I liked the pirate ships idea, sending TV signals from offshore.
Busted BBC's balls till they caved in.

[Stocko]

"It would be better to use a rubber hat."

Miss Stocko say's that I think with my dick! Does this mean that a condom will shield my thoughts? lol.
The thought of some loser sitting in a van outside my house tugging on his horn is pretty funny. :rolleyes:

Stocko :cool:

[10ON.EXE]

I liked the pirate ships idea, sending TV signals from offshore.
Busted BBC's balls till they caved in.

Not sure about the TV signals, but stations like Radio Caroline (still going today) and Radio London were broadcast from ships sailing up and down the coast of southern England. These stations along with some short lived ones forced the Beeb to adapt with the times. We could also get some Euro stations, mostly German, not a clue what they were yapping about, but the tunes were awesome.

It took a few years but we went from Glen Miller's Big Band sound to the Stones live at the Albert Hall on mainstream radio. Long live the pirates.

[knarf]

I see dead people!.... wearing rubber hats!
You Too ?

[freecharlie]

This thread is a fucking crackup!

Theres been some good points made, but the concept, is at this time pretty far fetched-

1) Your IRD, TV etc. DO emit radio signals(among others) but so do hindreds if not thousands of other household objects
---Distinguishing these signals, as they overlap in the spectrum, would be EXTREAMLY difficult, as every house in America is generating SOME kind of signal. Not only would it be difficult but it would be incredibly EXPENSIVE, because of how close in proximity you'd have to be to the source, and the cost, maintenance, & operation of said equipment. To send someone around in a van looking for the signals would be foolish, and not just because of the cost & near impossiblity of finding signals, but because of the privacy issues. Even if you could get the courts to go along with this, do you really think a judge is going to open up THAT "can of worms" and start a precidence by issueing a search warrent for the place in question? In the letter JT posted, the author states, "In some cases, undesired radio emissions can originate from other (non-satellite receiver) electronic equipment." A search warrent would NEVER be given based on speculation, hence the reason for the letter.
RFID security tags already have started their own privacy controversy over the possibility of law enforcement "tracing" the signals and the possible misuse of such. Do you really think they'll let someone drive around and "scan" the inside of your house? RIDICULAS!

2) The point was made about a signal being picked up ONLY if it was tansmmited, NOT recieved. While it is true that electronics of all sorts do give of background signals, they are simply NOT detecable from very far, UNLESS there is a significant power source being used for the TRANSMISSION of that signal. Shit if it was THAT easy to transmit & pick up a sgnal then we'd all be our watching Satallite TV on our wristwatches, and it would'nt need to be transmitted from an orbiting satallite -Fact is, signals diminish GREATLY over distance. Not only that but the further out you are, the greater background noise, static, or inerference becomes. Problem is, there are SOOOOO many signals and they all overlap each other on the spectrum, so to distingish one from the rest is impossible at distances.

3) If there WAS such equipment out there OR if you belive that there is, aluminum foil acts as a Faraday cage. This is why you always see the nutcases wearing tinfoil hats and such. According to prominent researchers, it only takes a VERY thin sheet of metal(ie. aluminum foil) to bounce a signal and keep it from transmitting. Petty theives have already caught on to this. If your interested, take a smal piece of tinfoil into a store, find an RFID(radio Frequincy Identification) tag, wrap up, and walk through the security detector. And THESE tags were MADE to transmit... Notice that you have to be in close proximity to a detector for it to pick up a signal. -Thats because the signal, at this time, can't be transmited very far. If you have extra money laying around(thats most of us right?) buy into a RFID stock--It is most certainly the future. Walmart and others are backing companies like ID Systems, in an effort to develope tags that transmit strongh enough signals to be watched from a distance. This is supposedly to track inventory AND prohibit theft. I wouldn't be suprised to see them in future IRD's.

Moral of the story? -Wrap your IRD in tinfoil! -LMAO!

FC

[smilingjack]

That's what the people In England said when they started the TV police.
Of course it was the Government that was benefiting so they got away with it.

[10ON.EXE]

That's what the people In England said when they started the TV police.
Of course it was the Government that was benefiting so they got away with it.

The money collected actually goes to the BBC.They have the special status of being State Broadcaster and it is to help cover the cost of their 8 channels.

Going back to the theme of the thread.The Detector Vans would drive around and the equipment inside would detect the local oscillator that leaks from the feeder that goes to the ariel. The most effective method though was,each TV set that you bought from the shop was registered, and if no licence was purchased then they would work an area of each city knocking on doors of those who were not in the TV licence database.

My buddy back home tells me that they are now going after PC users who have a TV tuner in their PC . They use the same method as above, not in database get a visit.

They also have an odd distiction between colour and black and white TV's. A licence for a black and white TV was always a lot cheaper. Must have cost them more to put all them colours in the broadcast.


Licence cost 150 pounds. Fine cost 1000 pounds

[smilingjack]

You mean they still do it ?
What with all the limey's working on the Cruise Ships I see buying TV's and Computers here they must be having a field day if they are.

I thought they moved out of the dark ages and had advertising to pay for it now ?
The BBC is part of the government.

[geechrammstein]

Left the dark ages, shit they still have a ruling monarchy (if that's what you want to call it) and a queen !!!